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10-16-2007, 12:30 PM
(This post was last modified: 02-19-2008, 12:14 PM by Director Michael.)
If Israel was to rid itself of it's secular leadership and replace it with Torah-observant leaders who made the Torah the law, could there ever be a situation where someone could legally be stoned or stoned to death?
Thanks,
Jake
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10-21-2007, 02:33 PM
(This post was last modified: 10-21-2007, 02:57 PM by Director Michael.)
The answer to your question is no. Here are some important points to remember:
1) Only a fraction of the Torah's commanded prohibitions are designated as capital sins. G-d assigned a specific mode of execution for each capital sin, if the sinner is tried and convicted by a Torah-empowered court ("beis din," literally meaning "house of judgment").
2) For Jews, one of four possible modes of execution is designated within Torah law. One of these was "stoning." and it only applied for Jews, not for Gentiles.
3) For Jews, Torah-sanctioned trial and execution can only be carried out by the "Great" (i.e. Supreme) Sanhedrin of 71 Jewish Sages, holding court in Jerusalem, in their designated location on the Temple Mount, during an era when the Holy Temple is standing and functioning with the sacrificial services by the Jewish priests (kohanim), as described in the Torah. Those conditions have not existed for almost 2000 years.
4) The method of execution called "stoning" in the Torah actually involved drugging the convicted Jew (male or female) to insensitivity, after which the designated executioner pushed the person off of a high tower onto a stone pavement below, thereby killing the person instantly. In the very unlikely event that the person was not killed by the impact of the fall, the fatal blow would be delivered by dropping a single massive stone onto the person's chest.
5) The Temple will not be rebuilt, and the Great Sanhedrin will not be re-established, until Moshiach comes. But when Moshiach comes, may this be immediately please G-d, all Jews will do complete repentance and none will ever sin again. Therefore there will not be any stonings.
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02-17-2008, 02:18 AM
(This post was last modified: 02-19-2008, 12:43 PM by Director Michael.)
I am rather new at being a Noahide and I don't conceal my convictions as a De Leonist Socialist either. However, I don't see Noahides becoming a mass movement any time soon and I get a bit upset when other Noahides talk of the death penalty over blasphemy of G-d's name when it comes to courts of justice. I figure G-d can take care of those people who do blaspheme because He is G-d. When it comes to people harming others then that is a much easier matter to deal with. There are organizations that deal with the ethical treatment of animals too. Of course there is that one class who owns the industries and does not operate them... Another class operates them but does not own them. I find exploitation at the point of production is as much as theft as outright theft.
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About stoning:
I have a Christian friend whom I always like to have discussions with; she likes to argue her religion is better than Judaism and in turn my being a Noahide. One day she and her pastor father quoted the Bible and stated that no Jew is a true Jew unless they stone people to death. I was so taken aback by this that it infuriated me. We never argue, however this nearly killed our friendship until I calmed down enough to apologize.
My question is: is she correct? Are Orthodox Jews not 'real Jews' because they don't stone people to death?
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On the contrary, this proves that she and her pastor don't have even the most basic understanding of the Bible verses they are quoting, since the Bible itself explains that it is totally forbidden for any Jews to practice stoning under the conditions that have existed for the past 2000 years.